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User Created Shops/Markets




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 Post subject: User Created Shops/Markets

JR Community Manager
Joined: Oct 04, 2012
Posts: 174
Location: Canada

How would this work? Would there be certain days or events triggered in the game to create or allow users to go to the market and host their own shops? If you were to go the shop route would you need a special case to carry/hold all the items you are selling?

We would love to hear what you guys think before handing juicy tid bits.

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Master Fluff
Joined: Oct 05, 2012
Posts: 191

I'd much rather see a communal market with players occupying stalls than SWG style individual buildings with NPC shopkeeper hirelings.

As for it only occuring on certain days/times, I think you official types need to find the right balance for the server population. Assuming you want this to be the main means of commerce, it needs to happen frequently enough that people can actually get stuff done but seldom enough that it concentrates the people and activity into a short enough window to create a bustling, vibrant atmosphere.

A few thoughts:

Use a lottery system to assign stalls, or possibly even to decide who gets a stall in the event that there's more sellers than stalls. If crafters have to camp the market to get a good stall, that's just going to suck.

Reduce the radius that the local chat window picks up chattering. Having an entire market full of people spamming the chat window with promises of low, low prices would, again, suck. Keep it to where you can hear the stall to either side and one forward and back. If it's a busy market, it's not as if you'd be able to hear much over the din, so it's fairly realistic as well.

Make it easy to find a stall that's selling what you want to buy. Possibly with some sort of search function that would highlight the stall on a mini-map like a shopping mall you-are-here sign.

Make selling require active player participation. If you're going to all this trouble to get people to interact it kind of defeats the purpose if the seller can just set up shop, go AFK for two hours and come back to an empty inventory and a full bank account. And a system that can be bypassed with macros or bots is just as bad.

I'd like to see each stall with a limited display space that the seller could stock with a selection of goods for the server to index and present to potential customers in a searchable format. As things get sold from the display space they would need to be restocked and the seller would have to decide what items to have searchable and which to merely shout about in the local chat window. Plus it presents an opportunity for buyer/seller dialog: Do you have 'Item X'?... No, but I can get it for you... etc.


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Been there, Maul'd that
Joined: Oct 03, 2012
Posts: 1131

old greg wrote:
Make it easy to find a stall that's selling what you want to buy. Possibly with some sort of search function that would highlight the stall on a mini-map like a shopping mall you-are-here sign.
THIS will be very important. A server wide search function. I think that a fee should be charged for putting the item up for sale.

Also, it would be nice to be able to use the (trade network) to put a 'request' in for items. A fee should also be charged for placing an ad as well.

Just thinking out load. I have no idea what the DEVs have in store for us.

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Chochobi Slayer
Joined: Oct 05, 2012
Posts: 53

I like the idea of markets and stalls, but I think forcing them to be staffed by actual players at all times is not a good idea. Maybe the stalls in the prime locations, or the biggest stalls are reserved for players who are going to be actively selling, but to me, just no... I might be interested in doing that from time to time, but I don't feel like it's adding much to force me to sit there the whole time. I like crafting, I like creating things, and I'll deal with customers for custom orders and special deals, but I see no benefit to sitting around a stall pretending I'm a wal-mart cashier, lol. Doesn't sound fun to me. So how about some NPC hirelings to man the smaller, less impressive stalls? Also, I still would want to run a shop out of my house as well, SWG-style.

Also, on a side note, there was an event on my SWG server once where a city partitioned off a section of their city for people to place vendor tents to create a temporary "fair grounds" type thing. It seemed pretty successful, but they only did it once because some people never took their tents down after the event was over. I think it was supposed to last a week. Maybe if there were temporary "vendor tents" in the game then players could organize their own markets.


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Dances with Lithu
Joined: Oct 13, 2012
Posts: 271
Location: Eastcoast USA

If there is going to be stalls or a physical way to set up shop there needs to be a place set aside for the market. If there isn't, shops/ tents will pop up everywhere. It will become a big mess. I've seen this happen in other games. Shops everywhere, on spawn points, in the middle of streets, cluttering up nice areas fighting for the perfect spot.
An action house should be an option as well for those that only have one or two items to sell. Having a limit to the number of items you can have for sell will keep it for small sellers.
Other games I have played changed the player into a shop. The player has a menu that they fill with a limited number of items. The player can't move or do anything while they are selling but they can type in chat. So if you want to hock your wears and advertise what you are selling that is possible.
Everyone could start off with a basic shop that will hold 8 - 10 items. If they want more slots they can purchase them. Being able to buy other shop skins to change the look of the store would be nice as well.

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Master Fluff
Joined: Jan 09, 2013
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I think if players want to sell anything in stalls, the player can do it anytime anywhere. Rules such as where the stalls should be and all that should be work by faction leaders so the leader can have freedom to experiment to see what works and what doesn’t. I do agree with you that things that are being sold should be on display within the stall and not in an inventory for players to look at. This would give the game a closer sense of realism and limit how much can be sold at once. Merchant players can also think about expanding their store and building a big building that can hold multiple items on display for players to buy. Merchant players who cooperate with each other can own big businesses in the world and create big buildings for players to visit and buy. These big businesses can also create emblems that represent their company and publicize these emblems by marking it on the cosmetic clothes they sell.

About players occupying stores, I agree that no one wants to occupy a stall for a whole day. So I suggest that NPC characters be available for players to hire. These Npc characters will charge the player for certain of time and will occupy the stall for the player. These NPC characters will allow the owner of the stall to focus on playing and not waiting for customers to come by.

NPC character rules:
- if the time that the player paid the NPC character is up, and the player has not return then the NPC character will do the following: They will pack up the store and leave at a building in the main city for the player to retrieve with the money the player made that day. They will also get a small portion of the money the character makes for that day.

- Merchant Players can also hire NPC guards that protect their goods from thieves and wanted characters.

- All NPC characters will be able to be hired at the main city where they will only occupy that market for a couple of days. Players who want These NPC characters to stay longer will have to pay more money to the Enterprise that is sending the player these NPC characters.

- Traveling with these characters is allowed, but players are responsible for the lives of these NPC characters. If they were to die, then the player will have to pay a huge fee to the enterprise and they may even cancel your contract with them for a certain amount of time preventing you from hire-ring more NPC characters. Players are also responsible for the guards that are killed also. If the player decides to kill one of the NPC characters or has let one of them to die without reporting to the company for a time of 2 weeks, The company will consider that player an outlaw and send out a bounty on that players head to be arrested (captured) or killed.

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Last edited by blandantey on Fri Jan 18, 2013 6:27 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Gasuta Floater
Joined: Dec 27, 2012
Posts: 222
Location: The Lou

old greg wrote:
Make selling require active player participation.


I'm not sure I like this idea. :(

As a casual player I'm already going to be spending a lot of my game time gathering resources and crafting, then after all that I'll have to stand around selling my stuff instead of doing other things in the game seems very tedious and will consume the limited amount of time I have to play the game. I would rather be spending my active game time doing PvE, PvP, and more crafting/harvesting. To me my "active participation" is the hours upon hours I've spent making my goods.

Also, all this limits some players, we don't all play at the same time, so to have special times to sell would hinder players that play during non-peak hours. How are you suppose to sell stuff if no ones playing at the time that I play?? Some peoples real life work schedule doesn't make a live participation AH very fun and enjoyable let alone trying to make money during non-peak hours.

I'm not opposed to the ideas, but I would hope that if they did an live AH market that for the casual players and folks that can't be gaming 24/7 that they have NPC vendors for your shop or house also!

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Qulinta Trash Picker
Joined: Oct 03, 2012
Posts: 481
Location: Haaften Netherlands

blandantey wrote:
I think if players want to sell anything in stalls, the player can do it anytime anywhere.

I dont think it would be a good idea you could then sit on a npc and put shop on there blocking that npc.

blandantey wrote:
Rules such as where the stalls should be and all that should be work by faction leaders so the leader can have freedom to experiment to see what works and what doesn’t.

I do agree on that point, and they should be able to raise a sell tax (with a maximum of 10%) but only on player owned city's npc owned towns should have a standart tax of 5%.

blandantey wrote:
I do agree with you that things that are being sold should be on display within the stall and not in an inventory for players to look at. This would give the game a closer sense of realism and limit how much can be sold at once.

I agree on that part.

blandantey wrote:
Merchant players can also think about expanding their store and building a big building that can hold multiple items on display for players to buy.

On this part it could be solved with the players house to make a store of it.
Do note stores could be far from each other within a city.

blandantey wrote:
Merchant players who cooperate with each other can own big businesses in the world and create big buildings for players to visit and buy. These big businesses can also create emblems that represent their company and publicize these emblems by marking it on the cosmetic clothes they sell.

Make a mechantguild but limmit it to 1 each fraction.

blandantey wrote:
About players occupying stores, I agree that no one wants to occupy a stall for a whole day. So I suggest that NPC characters be available for players to hire.

Good idea but make it citybound.

blandantey wrote:
NPC character rules:
- if the time that the player paid the NPC character is up, and the player has not return then the NPC character will do the following: They will pack up the store and leave.

Agree on that then the spot on the market is free for the next player.

blandantey wrote:
- Merchant Players can also hire NPC guards that protect their goods from thieves and wanted characters.

For this you have city guards.

blandantey wrote:
- All NPC characters will be able to be hired at the main city where they will only occupy that market for a couple of days. Players who want These NPC characters to stay longer will have to pay more money to the Enterprise that is sending the player these NPC characters.

Make that each individual city and each guild for guildowned citys and a citycounsel for npc owned citys.
Then guilds make some income out of this service and it would stimulate citycreation.

blandantey wrote:
- Traveling with these characters is allows, but players are responsible for the lives of these NPC characters. If they were to die, then the player will have to pay a huge fee to the enterprise and they may even cancel your contract with them for a certain amount of time preventing you from hire-ring more NPC characters. Players are also responsible for the guards that are killed also. If the player decides to kill one of the NPC characters or has let one of them to die without reporting to the company for a time of 2 weeks, The company will consider that player an outlaw and send out a bounty on that players head to be arrested (captured) or killed.

I dont agree on this killing a npc should always outlaw a player for a certain time.
If the player is seen in a city the npc guards should capture that player and put him in jail (the player can escape by braking out at his own risk of recapture).

A auctionhouse should also be citybound this would increase players travelling around to look for the best sellingspots.

And playerstorage should also be citybound for the sake of realism.
However he can buy more storage in each city at the citycounsil / guild for a fee ofcourse.

If a player would like to sell its items in a other city he has to transport them.

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Master Fluff
Joined: Jan 09, 2013
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1. Nyrill wrote:"I don’t think it would be a good idea you could then sit on a Npc and put shop on their blocking that Npc."

Well, maybe not in the main city, but anywhere else in the world should be available for players to set up shop. This way, the player can have shops in the wilderness, in caves, and anywhere within a player owned city. As long as the slope of the land that the player will set up shop is not very slanted, they should be able to set up shop there. If a player blocks an Npc in a player owned town, it would have to be removed by the players who owned the town. This would create a local issue for the player owned towns to deal with. Players who set up shop in the wilderness will have to defend themselves and their stall from monster attacks and player attacks.

2. Nyrill wrote: "I do agree on that point, and they should be able to raise a sell tax (with a maximum of 10%) but only on player owned city's Npc owned towns should have a standard tax of 5%."

I don't agree with the maximum or a minimum sales tax for the player owned cities. The player owned the city, so they should be able to raise the taxes as high or bring it down as low as they want. This would create friendly cities that support merchants and non-friendly cities that do not support merchants. Merchants will have to travel to find out what is the best friendly player owned city that i can sell my goods to get a good price for my gear.

3. Nyrill wrote: "On this part it could be solved with the player’s house to make a store of it.
Do note stores could be far from each other within a city."

I don't agree on that part. My vision was that players who would like to sell more items and have a permanent shop in that location can start to build their store. This store is expansive to create, but once created, that player will be able to display many items that that player wishes to sell.

4. Nryrill wrote: "Make a merchant guild but limit it to 1 each fraction."

I actually agree with you there a little bit. The only problem I have with this is [url=http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/monotonous monotonization[/url]. The players at the top of the merchant guild would control the new merchants that start out their stores. They can control this by saying that player sells really bad items, that player is trying to swindle you, false advertisement, ect. Also, my idea was focused on the point that in the future updates, the players can start to build upwards. So when that update comes, the cooperative merchant players can build a building that extends upwards or downwards to extend the amount of things they can display (merchants that do this will have to be popular first). So I’m not sure having a single guild per faction is a good idea.

5. Nyrill wrote: "For this you have city guards."

I don't agree on that point. Player's should be able to hire guards that will protect them as they traverse the open world where pvp and PVE would be hard for them to do. There can be a limit to having 10 guards each player. These guards will be private and would protect the interest of that player alone. Each of these guards will be strong as an average player and can vary in skill. Also, merchants should be able to put out request for player guards that would help that merchant traverse large plains that could contain monsters that are too strong for the private own guards to handle.

6. Nyrill wrote: "Make that each individual city and each guild for guild owned cities and a city council for Npc owned cities.
Then guilds make some income out of this service and it would stimulate city creation."

Okay, you are right on this point. If a player is selling inside the city, they can go to the faction to request an Npc. Players who are selling outside the city and have no allegiance to a faction can go to the main city to request a stall Npc for hire. Players without allegiance can also go to factions to ask for an Npc, but will of course have a lower chance of getting it because they are not a citizen of that faction. NPC's that belong to the factions would have to be bought by the factions for players to use. They are not immediately available after they faction has been created. All of these NPC's can be traveled anywhere with.

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Master Fluff
Joined: Jan 09, 2013
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7. Nyrill wrote: "I don’t agree on this killing an Npc should always outlaw a player for a certain time."

You are right that the player killing the Npc would not be outlawed unless that player was in a city. If the player killed the Npc out in the wilderness where there are no eyes to see, then that player would not be outlawed. If a player where to see another player killing that Npc, they can choose whether they want to report that player to the faction or not. The merchant however would be punished, if the Npc that operate the cashier is killed. The merchant would pay a fee to the main town or the guild for the death of that Npc. The merchant can choose manual labor instead of this fee though. If the merchant does not pay this fee, then the merchant would be flagged outlawed in that particular faction or from the main city.

8. Nyrill wrote: "A auction house should also be city bound this would increase players travelling around to look for the best selling spots."

I don’t think it should only be limited to city bound. Players who do not choose to be part of a faction can start their own auction house out in the wild where they think they would not be interrupted. This way outlaw player/deserters/mercenary guilds/assassin guilds can go to these actions if they do not want to be continuously hunted by the town guards. This way there is much more freedom to where an auction house can happen.

9. Nyrill wrote: "And player storage should also be city bound for the sake of realism. However he can buy more storage in each city at the city council / guild for a fee of course."

I don’t agree with that. A storage room should be able to be built by a player anywhere they wish outside of the main city. If the player wants to build a storage room in a cave, then they can. if they want to built it on the top of a mountain, then they can. This gives the player freedom and not a set option where they can only store there things in cities. Cities that already have storage rooms can always allow it to be for public use at a fee. This gives player flexibility so if they were to become outlaws, they would not be restricted by the games systems.

10. Nyrill wrote: "If a player would like to sell its items in a other city he has to transport them."

Yes, I totally agree with that statement. This is where vehicles, mounts, carts, roads, and other things come into play that let the player have options on how they will transport their items. They also have to watch out for monsters, player bandits, outlaws, and will have to cross while crossing harsh terrains in stormy weathers. This gives the game realism and produces the risks of traveling from one place to another across wide distances.

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